Curse

Gwenhywar · Aug 08, 2005, 02:52 AM // 02:52

Note: please, if you belong to the majority of posters who are playing on American servers, do not post flames (unless you have some constructive ideas/suggestions). Please no "just move to American servers" suggestions etc ...

The problem: well, Europe almost never gets the favor. And it's not because we don't care about PvP, or getting it, but because there's just too little European players in comparison with american/korean.

I haven't seen any numbers for GW, but in one article ANet mentioned that in the whole market of online gaming, there are 20 million customers in Korea, 2 million in North America and just 200k in Europe. Proportions are probably different for GW, but they can't be THAT much different than the online gaming market as whole (I have heard of 50+ district cities on American servers ... never seen more than ~10 districts at peak times here, some half empty).

Currently anyone playing on European server is automatically receiving a more limited gaming experience than players from other servers. A large part of players that have completed the game want to do UW/FoW, for fun or profit. Since Europe is getting favor for an hour once a week usually, most casual players will actually NEVER be able to experience the favor-based areas. Why such discrimination?

Something HAS to be done about it soon, to stop the emigration of active players who want to have a chance for UW/FoW. It's understandable, but ruins the concept of having the regions in the first place!

Possible solutions:
1) Change of the way favor is gained - sort of an affirmative action to give a handicap to the minority player base. Let Europe gain favor after 3 battles won, not 5 - this would even out the fact that there are less competitors to fight for the favor.

2) Put a clear warning on the game box that if you are a European customer and want to stay such, you will receive a limited gaming experience because of access to certain areas being region-based. It does not help to solve the problem but at least acknowledge the fact of discrimination.

3) Change the access to UW/FoW system completely. I wouldn't vote for this one myself, since I love the whole idea of cheering for your region - it's just that it's so upsetting seeing your region not being able to compete on equal footing with the big regions.

Krank · Aug 08, 2005, 03:16 AM // 03:16

There is a thread (or nine) on this subject

Id go for #2 because its the most realistic solution

Thomasuwoo · Aug 08, 2005, 03:19 AM // 03:19

I posted a suggestion To help out the Europeon players here. I've also linked it to several favour for Europe posts. It has had 40 views and ZERO replies. here it is. International Temple Of Ages.
Curently on page 4 and falling fast. Have a look and see what you think.

DrSLUGFly · Aug 08, 2005, 03:58 AM // 03:58

How to eliminate the WaW system.. all Europeans move to american servers.

This isn't just a ploy to get favor more often. This is a strategy to show Anet that Europeans are unhappy with the WaW system. As the European sales to European server load ratio becomes grossly unbalanced they will begin to take seriously the multitude of complaints against WaW found on forums. So... Go to the American server. This isn't just a "can't beat em, join em" strategy, this is a subtle but highly effective protest.

Krank · Aug 08, 2005, 04:00 AM // 04:00

Dr is right, that is best way... i suppose...
(i have lag problems here on east coast servers so you cant blame it all on lag..)

TheGreatBoo · Aug 08, 2005, 04:04 AM // 04:04

Yeah, I'm sorry to hear that. This is the first time I've seen anyone bring this to light. I agree with you 100%, this should be changed somehow so that europe has a fighting chance. I would actually suggest combining european and american favor. Keep which country gains the favor, but make both countries benefit from each other. 2.2 million against 20 million doesn't seem unfair to me.

Como Fort · Aug 08, 2005, 09:07 AM // 09:07

I'm European (Come from England), and I don't think its really that unfair. If Europe were any good, then we deserve the favor. I never play in European Districts, why, because alot of Europeans SUCK at games.

Timoz · Aug 08, 2005, 09:53 AM // 09:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by DrSLUGFly

How to eliminate the WaW system.. all Europeans move to american servers.

This isn't just a ploy to get favor more often. This is a strategy to show Anet that Europeans are unhappy with the WaW system. As the European sales to European server load ratio becomes grossly unbalanced they will begin to take seriously the multitude of complaints against WaW found on forums. So... Go to the American server. This isn't just a "can't beat em, join em" strategy, this is a subtle but highly effective protest.

I'm european, english even, so language wouldn't be too much of a problem. Personally, i don't want to change all to american. All due respect to Americans but i'd hate that. Three ways competing for the favor works much better. The only thing i'm annoyed with the way it is, is the level of the players in our home districts.

Those who go in their occasionally, or when you go to the tomb etc in euro districts when you first enter the game will see. It's stupid. Most of the teams in there being made, they actually do just randomly invite people and go when their full, i'd not be suprised if half of them didn't make it past the ghosts.

There are so many good quality euro players who have changed districts, OR they use international districts to form parties, i for one can't blame them
and do the same with the international part.

As for a solution, i don't agree with any you've said. I would'nt want a handicap to make it easier, i wouldn't want a warning on my game box basically saying euro's suck at this game atm, you won't have acces to places because they suck.

What i would want is for it to be left alone and gradually improve. If something does have to be done, it's got to get the players back to euro servers. if they are Americans living in Europe, or Koreans alike they switch to american servers straight away. (that should be the only warning on the box)
Europe ARE doing better at the moment, we ARE getting better, give it more time maybe.?

Another thing, after talking with a good Dutch friend of myn last night, maybe in euro servers there should only be English districts?

Italian ones, Spanish are always nice and empty, i use them to meet quite often infact they're pretty useful empty districts. The fact is they should'nt be there if they are empty. Most people in europe speak at least a little English, maybe it would be unfair, all non-english people ive spoken to seem to agree.

...I see UW and FoW, as a reward for PvP, the districts when we do get the favor are always full. Where are all these people in the PvP system? They're in the PvE all the time. When the fact is those who PvP work for them to go on a farming trip. Fair enough they might enjoy this more, each to their own.

Bu maybe if they helped out a bit instead of moaning we don't have the favor 24/7. (not directed at anyone inparticular.) Go in ToA when we lose the favor you will see what i mean. It's like a lil moan fest.

Gwenhywar · Aug 08, 2005, 10:52 AM // 10:52

Thanks everyone for the replies. The fact that the other threads on this topic fell so fast just proves the point - there is not a lot of people who are seeing it as a problem, since most posters play on American.

I'm actually canadian, but am playing on Euro servers because I live here right now and the timezone issues pretty much force it. That, and I like my Euro guild.

Anyway, it's not the point ... the point is, if there are Euro servers, their players should be given an equal chance. That's all people are asking for.

Ashley Twig · Aug 08, 2005, 11:36 AM // 11:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gwenhywar

Anyway, it's not the point ... the point is, if there are Euro servers, their players should be given an equal chance. That's all people are asking for.

The chance is there. Europeans just don't seem to want to take it.

On some other thread I started a few days ago, people stated, that they don't care so much about the favor when batteling in the HoH, but more about their own team winning.

Somebody said: If I see a french team I don't care about korea, but go for the french team.

It's like a team from texas going for southdakota or something.

So, as long as europeans don't act as one big europe, and rather battle themselves but america and/or korea, europe will continue not getting the favor.

Timoz · Aug 08, 2005, 12:53 PM // 12:53

I blame that on the french

We do win the favor, we are winning it more. Is it just me noticing this.? Am i dreaming or something. hmm

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...772#post362772

^ i suggest you check this thread Gwen.

cat1982 · Aug 08, 2005, 01:00 PM // 13:00

To be honest i dont really see the problem in switching territoires, is it just out of some kind of stubborn patriotism that u stay in Europe? I'm English and played the game through twice in the European territory, but having paid my money I would like to be able to experience just as much as any other paying customer, so I switched to America, I dont play PvP at all, have no interest in PvP, but i like being able to access UW and FoW pretty much whenever I want.

Dont wanna flame you but I dont see the big deal, either switch to America or get some cheese to go with that whine.

C
Xxx

Rayea · Aug 08, 2005, 03:14 PM // 15:14

since i suck bigtime on PvP, and i guess that would also mean i was BAD at guild and HoH fights, i havent realy got much interest in the part about who won and who lost as such...

however, i do feel that it is unfair to us in te euro section that we never sem to be able to get into the UW and Fissure.
befor you ask, why am i bothered if i dont PvP, let me explain...

its not or the favour/favor...its because i cant explore these areas without the favour/favor.
sure, im not at lvl 20 yet, nor do i have the assention part done, but i want to be able to go there once i can.
i can wander about in the temple of heroes right now as a non20 unacended player but thats about it (as far as i know)

when i make it past that lot, i still need to not only wait for the gods, but have to grab a PUG or something befor time runs out.

so.....sumariseing....i think it would benefit everyone, not just us euro players, if they took the favour/favor and disconected it from these places.
make it that the favour/favor is conected only to the gods themselves. then you can add lots of little quests for the gods to send us mortals on, and these can only be gained while the gods are in your server, whch is why people can fight for their favour.
the PVP people will fight anyway, a good run in the HoH ca gain way too many points in faction to be ignored and why should they?

then everyone can get in, provided they have the requisite acended and level 20 parts.

Dalamar Nightshadow · Aug 08, 2005, 04:54 PM // 16:54

First off lets determine that it isn't a population problem. Korea's population is drastically less than Europe's population. I believe the problem lies with language.

- All of Korea I assume generally speaks one common language on the Korean servers.

- All of America generally speaks one common language on the American servers.

- Europe has many different languages and not a common language. This can inhibit powerful group forming due to language barriers. Europe created the Euro to resolve currency barriers; time for Europe to decide on a common language or create a common one.

Instead of restricting access to UW and FOW they should make UW and FOW much harder and let everyone in. Then they could give the region with the favor of the gods a bonus to make UW/FOW easier. This doesn't solve the problem but at least it would still give all areas access to everyone.

Maybe they should look at making language regions rather than geographical regions. I think this was the main reason for the region system. I know my keyboard cannot type Korean characters nor do French style e's. Perhaps they should create a region for 8 main common languages and get rid of the country/continent designation.

Mayar third Keeper · Aug 08, 2005, 05:47 PM // 17:47

@Timoz: thx for linking

Quote:

First off lets determine that it isn't a population problem. Korea's population is drastically less than Europe's population. I believe the problem lies with language.

I think you are wrong there is a thread out there wich provides some data:

2 million americans
200.000 europeans and
20 million Oo Koreans

But this doenst matter at all (doesn't matter if u doubt the data or not ) if the favour only depends on Quality but with the 8vs8vs8 maps it also depensd on Quantity!

Dalamar Nightshadow · Aug 08, 2005, 06:13 PM // 18:13

Are you telling me that there's more people in South Korea than all of Europe?

Anyways I was trying to make the point that Korea has a common language and Europe is sub-divided based on language.

I strongly agree that they need to keep the languages separated into different regions, and need to make all areas evenly accessable to everyone. They need to make the favor of the gods some type of bonus while doing quests/missions and not a key to gain access to special areas.

Mugon M. Musashi · Aug 08, 2005, 06:13 PM // 18:13

I don't know if those figures are accurate
but I'm pretty sure that Korean population > american population > european population

keep in mind that "Korea" doesn't include the korean people only (China, Japan and other asian countries)

Rayea · Aug 08, 2005, 07:03 PM // 19:03

agreed, Dalamar

i have been saying since the whineing first started that we needed to change the favour to being that the gods have an avatar in the winning server only, and that access to the UW and Fissure should be for everyone.

that the beneift of the gods was for us mere mortals to b able to acept quests and so forth on behalf of our gods to get ether rewards or whatever the gods chose to give us, and that would sertainly make some players fight for the favour.

however, when i think it through, i also like the deity faction idea.

hm..maybe there is a way to have both?

perhaps then the Gods that your groups are sided with will alow that gods followers into the UW and Fissure...hang about.....uh oh......no, scratch that, we might end up with a war between Grenth and Balthazar ect....theres enough fights about that with real world religeons.

ok, then instead of faction of deity alowing their followers into the UW anf Fissure, it should give a benefit also in these places. maybe the deity in question shows you a kindness, so making ether there be better drops or exp or *something*, yet everyoe can still get in...

(we dont want things to get ugly between deity factions here, its a game not a fight about which deity is best)

Ultimate_Gaara · Aug 08, 2005, 10:25 PM // 22:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mugon M. Musashi

I don't know if those figures are accurate
but I'm pretty sure that Korean population > american population > european population

keep in mind that "Korea" doesn't include the korean people only (China, Japan and other asian countries)

they should just change it to Asia, that would confuse less people

as for the favor problem, i don't know how i could help, i never pvp so thats out of my ability... just keep trying i guess...

Pandanslesdents · Aug 08, 2005, 10:44 PM // 22:44

First, I think that making a PvE zone access as a reward for PvP contest totally absurd.

Second, Europe will never be able to compete on equal grounds with US and Korea because of the language barrier. One language in Korea, one in the US and 5 in Europe. Add to that that the number of players in Europe is drastically lower than in the US and Korea, and you are certain that Europe winning the favor is an exceptionnal event. I play on the french server, and explain me how can a few hundred players compete against many hundreds players on 20 or more US servers? Last time it happened, it was past midnight, a time where most players are off anyway... Sure there are good players in Europe too, but there are many more in the US, simply because there is more players there. And how many of them already migrated to the US servers anyway? A lot I would guess.

ArenaNet don't seem to care that much about this, otherwise they would have fixed it already.

One solution would be to let Korean and American fight together for it on their side, and have a separate Favor of the gods contest for the European servers, where they would fight one against the others for it.

But the most logical solution would be to make access to these zones via a difficult quest that you should do everythime you wish to enter them. And devise another reward for those PvP fanatics.